Sign In or Create an Account.

By continuing, you agree to the Terms of Service and acknowledge our Privacy Policy

Podcast

What a Permitting Reform Deal Could Look Like

Rob talks with Daniel Palken, the director of infrastructure for energy and permitting at Arnold Ventures, about the policies that would probably make up a grand bargain.

•
The Capitol.
Heatmap Illustration/Getty Images

There’s really one one good thing that could happen this year in Congress for clean energy: permitting reform. If lawmakers reached a bipartisan deal on the country’s permitting system, they could make it easier to build solar, wind, and transmission lines — as well as every other kind of infrastructure.

But will it happen? What are the obstacles to a deal? What would be in a deal? On this episode of Shift Key, Rob is joined by Daniel Palken, the director of infrastructure for energy and permitting at Arnold Ventures. They discuss the recent history of permitting reform, the policies that would probably make up a deal, and why it might be now or never for reforming the permitting system.

Shift Key is hosted by Robinson Meyer, the founding executive editor of Heatmap News.

Subscribe to “Shift Key” and find this episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon, or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can also add the show’s RSS feed to your podcast app to follow us directly.

Here is an excerpt from their conversation:

Robinson Meyer: Something I've heard about this go at permitting reform is that this might be it. Now, maybe that isn't true. But what I've heard is basically, you know, next Congress, it's unlikely to be as productive for permitting reform as this Congress will be. Of course, something I've also heard is that if Democrats want to set themselves up to do big public investments in the energy system, when the next president takes office, whoever that may be in 2029, then you need to get the statutory changes. And now because the implementation will then take long enough that it won't really start to kick in until 29.

But why is it important that this happens now that this Congress finds a deal as opposed to future Congresses?

Daniel Palken: This goes back to more inside baseball, but like, you know, the Senator Whitehouse and Senator Heinrich, we mentioned near the top are two Democratic senators who are really eager to find if there's a workable bipartisan space for a deal by all outward indications. You know, it's not a given that every Democrat and every Republican, for that matter, you know, feels exactly that way. So part of it is just we have a cadre of four senators at the top of these committees on both Democratic and Republican side who are really approaching this constructively and in good faith. That doesn't mean success is guaranteed, but there's going to be turnover next Congress. So with Senator Durbin, who's currently the head of the Judiciary Committee retiring, there seems to be a good likelihood that Senator Whitehouse will head over to the Judiciary Committee. And then you'll likely get someone like Senator Merkley atop the Environment and Public Works Committee. Now, Senator Merkley is by some measures on environmental issues, the most progressive senator.

It just may be hard for him to find a bipartisan deal space between someone like Senator Merkley on the one hand and something that like President Trump might sign off on on the other hand. The usual status quo in D.C., the default assumption we should have is that there's a non-overlapping Venn diagram space between Democrats and Republicans on any given issue that like isn't NDAA and doesn't have to pass. And the reason we know that is because most issues don't pass major reforms in their space most years. And so the presumption should be that it's very hard to pass something. And then in the House, you have a situation where, you know, if you go on polymarket, it will tell you that Democrats have a meaningfully better than not chance of taking the House. And I think that the people who will chair the relevant House committees, I think there's some level of interest in exploring permitting reform, but they haven't been at it, you know, for as long in the way that Senator Whitehouse and Heinrich have. And I kind of think that we have been very blessed with some senators atop these committees now that really have a vision on this, right?

I haven't said this explicitly, but one of the things that really is the motive force that is enabling permitting to happen is that both sides don't agree on much, but they agree on one crucial fact, which is that their resources are better than the other side's resources. Republicans have an absolute conviction that in a free market that, you know, gas and coal and sometimes nuclear will outcompete, you know, Democrats' resources. And Democrats have an absolute conviction that wind and solar and sometimes nuclear will out-compete Republicans' resources. And, you know, the market is going to determine who is correct on that. But the fact that both sides – and it's good that both sides – we would want – you know, it would be weird if people were supporting resources they had no confidence in. The fact that both sides have confidence in their resources is kind of what is enabling this to happen in the first place. Because if either side, like, firmly believed that the other side's resources were better, they wouldn't want to do something necessarily that enables the other side.

So those are kind of the elements of what I think makes this Congress a particularly ripe environment. And also there's one other thing, which is next Congress is a presidential election cycle. And it's harder to do something much harder the closer you get to a presidential election where everybody's distracted versus a congressional midterm election.

You can find a full transcript of the episode here.

Mentioned:

The FREEDOM Act, which would limit the president’s ability to yank permits

Rob’s SunZia story: The Long, Strange Success Story of America’s Biggest Clean Energy Project

Why the National Historic Preservation Act falls harder on transmission projects than pipelines

Previously on Heatmap: What Is Permitting Reform? Here’s a Cheat Sheet.

This episode of Shift Key is sponsored by ...

Tandem PV is the leader in perovskite solar technology. We’re building the most efficient and durable perovskite solar panels on the market at our factory in Freemont, California. Learn how we're restoring U.S. leadership for the next era of solar manufacturing at tandempv.com.

Music for Shift Key is by Adam Kromelow

Blue

You’re out of free articles.

Subscribe to access Heatmap's exclusive climate and energy polling, award-winning journalism, and subscriber-only events. Save $57 on an annual subscription, just $156 $99/year.
To continue reading
Create a free account or sign in to unlock more free articles.
or
Please enter an email address
By continuing, you agree to the Terms of Service and acknowledge our Privacy Policy
Energy

The Last-Minute Changes to the Senate Permitting Deal, Explained

A new version of the bill strives to address environmental and tribal concerns while strengthening some of its transmission provisions.

Power lines and data center construction.
Heatmap Illustration/Getty Images

We now have the updated final text of the bipartisan Senate permitting deal. Will it be enough to get the bill across the finish line?

On Saturday morning, senators released a reworked version of the Bipartisan Affordability and American Jobs Act. This version, known as a “manager’s amendment” under parliamentary procedure, aims to address many of the concerns and criticisms raised about the bill and will become the official legislative text that ultimately gets a vote in the Senate. There’s something in these changes for everyone – environmentalists, tribes, utilities – but it remains to be seen if they put the bill into a Goldilocks zone.

Keep reading...Show less
Climate

What to Know About COP31

The “35x35” electrification pledge and an AI pledge are on the table.

Antalya, Turkey.
Heatmap Illustration/Getty Images

World leaders are flocking to the Mediterranean resort town of Antalya, Turkey, this weekend for the 31st United Nations Climate Change Conference, also known as COP31. The U.S., of course, will once again not attend, as President Trump not only withdrew the country from the Paris Agreement but also from the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, the umbrella group that organizes the annual conferences. Still, 194 other governments will be there, putting their heads together on how to move another few inches toward a safer future.

This year, as with the last several convenings, the meeting arrives against a backdrop of geopolitical instability, worsening climate impacts, and growing concern about energy security and affordability. While conflicts like the Iran war in some ways bolster the case for the energy transition by surfacing the risks of fossil fuel dependence, prioritizing energy security can manifest as countries turning inward and showing less willingness to work for the global good.

Keep reading...Show less
Green
Politics

California Just Voted for Single-Payer Wildfire Insurance

Progressive candidate Jane Kim declared victory in the race for California Insurance Commissioner.

Jane Kim and Ben Allen.
Heatmap Illustration/Getty Images, Jane Kim, Ben Allen

Few political wonks outside of California were likely paying much attention to the Golden State on Tuesday night, as Democrats’ anticipated blue wave crested. But the state did have one close, consequential race on the ballot: insurance commissioner. On Friday, Bernie Sanders-endorsed progressive Jane Kim won the race to lead the California Department of Insurance, which oversees the state’s $452 billion insurance market.

Kim declared victory over the more moderate State Senator Ben Allen, who was backed by the California Democratic Party, after reaching a nearly six-point lead on Friday. In a brief speech before supporters, Kim said Allen called to congratulate her that morning. (A spokesman for the Allen campaign confirmed the call to The Orange County Register.) Kim ran on a proposal for a state-run, single-payer insurance program that would cover homeowners against wildfire damage — though the plan would ultimately need approval from both the California legislature and Governor-elect Xavier Becerra.

Keep reading...Show less
Yellow